Didn't see this posted, seems to like the Spurs trade.
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insid...eGrades-080221
Trade Grades: Who are the big winners and losers?
Hollinger
By John Hollinger
ESPN Insider
(Archive)
Insider
Updated: February 21, 2008
* Comment
What a whirlwind February. Eleven trades went down in just three weeks; combined with the three deals consummated prior to that point, we've had an unusually high 14 trades since opening night. And most of them weren't two-scrubs-for-a-second-rounder swaps either -- nearly every swap involved at least one prominent player changing squads.
With the deadline past, it's time to hand out report cards. Today we'll do a quick recap of each trade this season and grade the outcome for the each team involved. Obviously, a lot of water can go under the bridge between now and year-end (and beyond) that will determine how history remembers these deals, but here's my instant analysis:
Feb. 21: Cleveland trades Ira Newble and Donyell Marshall to Seattle; Chicago trades Ben Wallace, Joe Smith and a 2009 second-round pick to Cleveland; Seattle trades Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West to Cleveland; Cleveland sends Larry Hughes, Drew Gooden, Cedric Simmons and Shannon Brown to Chicago; Chicago sends Adrian Griffin to Seattle
For Seattle: It's pretty straightforward on their end. The Sonics exchanged two halfway-decent players who weren't in their plans (Szczerbiak and West) for players who make less money. This year and next year, they'll save a total of about $10 million.
In the meantime, Seattle GM Sam Presti has another trade exception to play with; the last time he had a big trade exception, he turned it into three first-round draft picks and a half-season of Kurt Thomas. And if he's lucky, a healthy Marshall will shoot the lights out next year and earn him another first-round pick at next year's deadline. Grade: B+
For Cleveland: Say this for Danny Ferry -- when he swings, he swings for the fences. He hasn't been able to get a deal done for the past two years in part because he's been going for big moves like this, which are harder to pull off. But when it works ... man, does it work.
This one works, big time. Answer me this: Would you rather have Larry Hughes (12.0 PER) or Wally Szczerbiak (16.0)? Shannon Brown (8.5) or Delonte West (10.1)? Donyell Marshall (8.5) or Ben Wallace (12.1)? Drew Gooden (12.8) or Joe Smith (17.4)?
The last one is the only comparison where you'd even hesitate, because Gooden has been better the previous several years. But Smith crushes Gooden on PER this season, and isn't prone to mental gaffes the way Gooden is.
Now consider how this all fits into the larger puzzle. LeBron James now has teammates who can actually shoot! No, seriously: Wally World is at 42.8 percent on 3s this year and 40.7 percent for his career; West is 37.0 percent for his career; and Smith is reliable from 17 feet who can space the floor. All three will help the Cavs space the floor and reduce the number of five-on-one defenses LeBron has to face.
That leaves Wallace, but there's even some upside here. Not for shooting, of course, but for all the other stuff he brings. I have had at least one scout tell me his poor results this year have been partly because he just wasn't playing hard; one wonders if the relocation will improve his spirits. And unlike Phoenix with Shaq, the Cavs didn't give up an All-Star in order to find out the answer to this question -- they just need Big Ben to play with some energy for 20 minutes off the bench as the fourth big man.
All told, this trade is a huge coup for Cleveland. They had to take on more salary (and a bigger luxury tax burden) to do it, so credit Cavs owner Dan Gilbert for busting out his checkbook. But they've been trying for two years to trade Gooden and Hughes; the fact they got something so worthwhile from the exchange is amazing. Grade: A-
For Chicago: Gasol, Garnett, Kobe ... we've all heard the rumors about these top-notch players coming to Chicago, and when they finally make a big trade, it's for the Cavs' leftovers.
But don't despair, Bulls fans -- it's not a bad trade for your team. Hughes gives the Bulls a big guard, finally, given that Thabo Sefolosha is not ready for prime time. And Hughes might be much better in Chicago than he was in Cleveland because there's so much more space on the floor for his drives. If so, it sets Chicago up to unload Ben Gordon this summer, perhaps in a sign-and-trade, and get a piece that fits better.
While Gooden is having a tough year, he is younger than Smith and has a better future -- and at this point Chicago should be thinking about the future rather than the present. Meanwhile, Wallace's departure allows them to get more minutes for Joakim Noah and Tyrus Thomas without the locker room imploding.
Finally, it didn't cost Chicago any of its long-term assets to make this trade, which means they can still put Gordon or Thomas or somebody of that ilk into a deal this summer.
It's probably a little disappointing to Bulls fans that they didn't pull off something more monumental, but for what it was, it's a decent trade, with Hughes' performance being the key. Grade: B
Feb. 21: Houston trades Bonzi Wells and Mike James to New Orleans and cash and the rights to Malick Badiane to Memphis; Memphis trades the rights to Sergei Lishouk to Houston; New Orleans trades Marcus Vinicius to Memphis; New Orleans trades Bobby Jackson and Adam Haluska to Houston
For New Orleans: The Hornets upgrade their bench and in Wells get a player who excels in the low post, two areas where they had been lacking. The Hornets are last in the NBA in free-throw attempts; having Wells torment smaller guards on the blocks could help fix that.
Jackson was expendable because of how well Jannero Pargo has been playing behind Chris Paul. Taking on James is the drawback, as the cap consequences are ugly: He's due $6.5 million in the first year that Chris Paul would make the max (assuming he's extended).
If you buy that this team should be thinking about the future as much as the present, I'm not sure the cap implications are worth that to upgrade from Jackson to Wells. But it does make the Hornets an even tougher customer come playoff time this season. Grade: B-
For Houston: They get under the luxury tax and out from the last year of James' burdensome contract, though at the cost of one of their better bench players.
However, Jackson's game fills a niche more easily in Houston than it did in New Orleans, where he was asked to spot up while Chris Paul created -- that ain't his thing. Jackson is something of a ball hog, but that's OK here because the Rockets badly need another shot-creator to use when Tracy McGrady or Yao Ming is off the court.
He's also very familiar with Rick Adelman's system, having played with him in Sacramento.
This deal helps their future and I'm not sure it makes their present any worse, making it a win-win for the Rockets. Grade: B+
For Memphis: A bit player in this deal, the Grizzlies essentially get paid off to take Vinicius' salary and get a free two-month look. Lishouk is in the deal only for the league to approve it; Badiane is a D-list prospect. Grade: Incomplete
Feb. 21: Minnesota sends Gerald Green to Houston for Kirk Snyder, a second-round pick and cash
For Houston: Given that the Rockets traded Bonzi Wells an hour earlier, one must presume they weren't real high on Snyder. Instead the Rockets get Green, who is raw and immature but might be able to give them a scoring boost off the pine.
Even if Green doesn't play a minute, Houston cuts nearly $1 million off its cap number -- which, coincidentally puts them nearly $1 million under the luxury tax. Needless to say, that money could prove helpful if a veteran comes along they'd like to sign while staying under the tax threshold. Plus, they might sell some extra tickets if Green comes out with the mascot and re-enacts that candle dunk during timeouts. Grade: B+
For Minnesota: They get a second-rounder and a free two-month look at Snyder before deciding whether to make a qualifying offer for him this summer. I have no idea why they gave up on Green so fast, but given that they had already made that decision before the season, this one makes sense. You can't say that about every Wolves move. Grade: B
Feb. 21: Portland trades Taurean Green to Denver for Von Wafer
For Portland: STOP THE PRESSES!!! Green for Wafer!!! Cue up the special SportsCenter and get Bucher on the phone, pronto ...
Um, not really. Actually, this trade is likely to be totally irrelevant. But Wafer can shoot the rock, and Portland likes shooters. Grade: Incomplete
For Denver: The Nuggets save a teeny bit of money ($454,562, to be exact) between salary and tax, and get an insurance point guard in case something happens to Anthony Carter. Additionally, Green has a team option for next year, which can be valuable currency in offseason trades. Grade: Incomplete
Feb. 21: Detroit sends Primoz Brezec to Toronto for Juan Dixon
For Detroit: It's a mild upgrade from the totally useless Brezec to the mildly useful Dixon -- if rookies Arron Afflalo or Rodney Stuckey lose their heads during the playoffs, he can come in and settle things down. Well, as much as things can "settle down" when he's jacking up every 20-footer he gets a halfway clean look at. But he's a better shooter than Flip Murray, at least. Grade: A-
For Toronto: The Euraptors were crestfallen when they acquired Dixon at the deadline last year and found out he was American. Exchanging him for Brezec fixes that nagging problem.
Also, Brezec is huge, and Toronto is desperate for size at the moment. But he's been horrid in his limited appearances the past two seasons. Personally, I'd rather have the guy who can play a little. Grade: C+
Feb. 20: Seattle trades Kurt Thomas to San Antonio for Brent Barry, Francisco Elson and a 2009 first-round pick
For Seattle: If you're keeping score, Sonics GM Sam Presti has now parlayed a single trade exception from the Rashard Lewis sign-and-trade into three first-round picks, with the latest coming from San Antonio in the Thomas deal. Getting the pick in 2009 rather than 2008 might be a shrewd move, too, if you buy that San Antonio's age problems could hit it hard next season; however, the pick is lottery-protected.
Barry has already been waived and Elson is a buyout candidate, incidentally, so the Sonics could save some money on that end too. Grade: A
For San Antonio: They needed another tough hombre in the frontcourt, especially with Robert Horry on the wane, and definitely got one in Thomas. He defends and can space the floor for Tim Duncan by hitting 15-footers from the free-throw line area, so in those respects he's a better version of Fabricio Oberto -- he just doesn't move without the ball like Oberto does.
The risk for San Antonio is that Barry will be bought out, sign with another team and start raining 3s on them in the playoffs. But with Barry sidelined by a calf problem, that's less of a risk -- if he'd been healthy the Spurs probably wouldn't have done this deal.
Additionally, the trade takes San Antonio under the luxury tax line. In fact, here's the really crafty part: They're now just enough under that they can sign a veteran free agent for the prorated league minimum and still avoid the tax. Somebody like, I don't know ... Brent Barry? Grade: A-
Feb. 19: Dallas signs Keith Van Horn and trades Van Horn, Devin Harris, Trenton Hassell, Maurice Ager, DeSagana Diop, first-round draft choices in 2008 and 2010, and cash considerations to New Jersey for Jason Kidd, Malik Allen and Antoine Wright; waives Nick Fazekas
For Dallas: A "makeup" trade for a failed deal involving Jerry Stackhouse and Devean George instead of Hassell and Van Horn, this version cost Mark Cuban $11 million more, counting salary and taxes, but looks almost as questionable.
Kidd didn't exactly calm doubts in his Dallas return, getting abused by the Hornets' Chris Paul, which was exactly the fear of Mavs fans when they traded their top perimeter defender in Harris. And Kidd's six turnovers were another example of something I've been harping on for a while -- Kidd has become increasingly mistake-prone this season.
Dallas wanted this trade as much for the locker room as the court, and I don't want to minimize that aspect of the deal. Just because it can't be measured doesn't mean it isn't there. But to give up two first-rounders (the second unprotected) and a quality post defender in Diop for what may not even be an upgrade at the point seems a stretch. Grade: C-
For New Jersey: It's tough to rebuild much better than this. The Nets got a rising second-tier star at the point in Harris, two first-rounders, a couple expiring deals, and a salary savings right off the top -- all for a 34-year-old guard whose numbers are down this year and who has a $20 million cap number. And as an added bonus -- yes, the hair gel and high socks are back in The Swamp! It's hard for me to imagine a better deal than that. Grade: A
Feb. 16: Atlanta acquires Mike Bibby from Sacramento in exchange for Shelden Williams, Lorenzen Wright, Anthony Johnson, Tyronn Lue and a 2008 second-round draft pick
For Sacramento: We had been hearing that they wouldn't deal Bibby unless the other party also took Kenny Thomas, but apparently they backed off on that. It's also surprising that they didn't prefer Cleveland's offer with Drew Gooden.
Williams has had an ugly year-and-a-half since being taken with the fifth overall pick in the 2006 draft, but his toughness and rebounding are rare commodities in Sactown, so the hope is he can fill the role that Thomas did before he lost it.
The other guys are expiring contracts, which won't help the Kings sign any free agents this summer but will help save them from the tax man when Kevin Martin's extension kicks in next year. The team may realize additional savings if they can buy out Lue or Johnson. Grade: B
For Atlanta: I'm on record on this one as saying the Hawks answered their two biggest needs in point guard and 3-point shooting. Bibby is only 29 and only has one year left on his deal, so from a risk perspective this was a very reasonable trade.
Atlanta has lost both its games since the trade, but they're in the midst of a rough West Coast trip -- yet another reason this deal was made. It's playoffs or bust for the team with the league's longest playoff drought; with the "bust" option likely resulting in wholesale changes. Grade: B+
Feb. 6: Phoenix acquires Shaquille O'Neal from Miami in exchange for Shawn Marion and Marcus Banks
For Miami: Are you kidding me? This was like having a bag of money drop in your lap, except that the bag contained $40 million. That's how much Miami effectively saves in this deal, by dropping their obligation to the dead-weight last two years on O'Neal's contract.
Marion can opt out of his contract after the season, but will help them whether he stays or goes. He either gives them beaucoup cap space or one of the best two-way forwards in the game.
And don't sleep on Banks. Though he didn't fit in Phoenix, his ability to pressure the ball and attack off the dribble could make a Banks-Wade-Marion perimeter trio a true terror with ball pressure and transition offense. Grade: A+
For Phoenix: As I've written, I hated this trade and nothing that happened Wednesday night changed my mind. Shaq was supposed to improve Phoenix's defense; in his first game they gave up 130 points.
I'll admit O'Neal looked better than I thought he would; on the other hand, Pau Gasol beat him down court by 30 feet twice in the final five minutes, which is pretty discouraging considering the court is only 94 feet long. Grade: D-
For Seattle: And now, for the big winner ... everyone remember that Kurt Thomas trade back in the fall? Phoenix sent Seattle two first-rounders in that deal.
What you might not remember is that the 2010 pick is completely unprotected. Didn't seem like a big deal with Phoenix's roster at the time, but now look at them. In the 2009-10 season, Shaq will be 37, Steve Nash will be 35, Grant Hill will be 37, and Raja Bell will be 33. With this trade, the value of that pick just went through the roof. Grade: A
Feb. 4: New Jersey acquires Stromile Swift from Memphis in exchange for Jason Collins and cash considerations
For New Jersey: The deal was virtually cap-neutral, but it did allow them a bit more space to sign a veteran for the Nets' late-season playoff run. Swift is a better player than Collins but a worse teammate; he does fit in with the goal of getting more athletic in the frontcourt, though. Grade: B
For Memphis: This was all about getting rid of Swift, who was suspended by the team in the game before the trade. He has a lot of ability, but hasn't improved since the day he entered the league; the only reason Memphis had him in the first place was because of Houston's salary-dump in the Rudy Gay trade. Grade: B-
Feb. 1: L.A. Lakers acquire Pau Gasol and a 2010 second-round draft pick from Memphis in exchange for Kwame Brown, Javaris Crittenton, Aaron McKie, the draft rights to Marc Gasol and first round picks in 2008 and 2010
For Memphis: Since nobody else is doing this, allow me to offer a defense of Grizzlies GM Chris Wallace by emphasizing this grade is for ownership as much as the management -- if you give the GM a mandate to cut costs, then a trade like this is the result.
Additionally, there's an element of hypocrisy in the other teams in the West screaming bloody murder about this deal. Remind me again: Which one of them made a better offer?
Unfortunately, getting rid of Gasol's contract (three years left at about $16 million per) became imperative because the team figured it would be just as easy to go 24-58 without him as it was with him.
And Memphis nailed all its goals in this deal -- it dumped Gasol's contract and got young players, cap relief and draft picks. You can argue about the quality of those items (the Lakers' draft picks will be late, and Crittenton and Marc Gasol are at best a couple years away from being major contributors), but it hit all the checkmarks.
Now, was this trade fair in strictly basketball terms? Probably not. Should Wallace have been more insistent that Brian Cardinal go along with Gasol? Absolutely. Would it have been overturned in a fantasy league? Sure, there's a good chance ... especially if Gregg Popovich were the commissioner.
But I can think of worse holdups than this, and the Grizzlies did what they thought they needed to do. Blame Memphis owner Michael Heisley if you want, but I'm not sure Wallace had a lot of great options here. Grade: D
For Los Angeles: You could see a trade like this coming for a while. In a relatively short time, the Lakers went from having a horrid bench in the final year of Shaq and Kobe to having the best second unit in the league. Mitch Kupchak hasn't received nearly enough credit for this.
That put them in position to trade several young players and draft picks for one big-time star, and after passing on such a proposition a year ago in a potential Jason Kidd trade, they went for it this time around.
Amazingly, it didn't cost them any of their top 10 players (if you don't count Kwame Brown), which is a tribute to how deep L.A. has become. And now they're the favorites to win the le. Kudos here also must go to Dr. Buss, who agreed to pay the luxury tax to get Gasol.
Grade: A
Dec. 29: Utah acquires Kyle Korver from Philadelphia in exchange for Gordan Giricek and a protected first-round pick
For Philadelphia: A fine opening salvo from new Sixers GM Ed Stefanski. Korver is a nice role player but a slightly overpaid one at about $5 million a pop for three more years. Dumping him for Giricek's expiring deal puts the Sixers well under the cap and positions them to make a run at a quality free agent this summer.
Getting a first-round pick out of it was icing on the cake, though it will probably be in the late 20s. The only negative is that Giricek is finished, so he's worthless for Philly's playoff run. Grade: A-
For Utah: You can argue they slightly overpaid. What you can't argue is that it wasn't the perfect move from an on-court perspective. Utah had been struggling with zones all year; when Korver showed up that problem magically went away.
Losing the first-rounder shouldn't hurt much either -- whomever they drafted was going to have trouble just making the active roster, as 13 Jazzmen have contracts for next year and C.J. Miles is a restricted free agent they'd probably like to bring back. Overall, a trade that really helped both sides. Grade: A-
Dec. 14: Charlotte acquires Nazr Mohammed from Detroit in exchange for Primoz Brezec and Walter Herrmann
For Charlotte: One of the biggest mysteries of the season is why the Bobcats banished Herrmann to the end of the bench after he played extremely well for them in the second half of the 2006-07 season. Of course, if I had a dime for every puzzling move the Bobcats have made in the past 18 months, I'd be wealthier than most of their players.
Swapping two expirings for Mohammed -- without even demanding a draft pick in return -- was another head-scratcher, as Detroit had been trying to dump him for a while. He'll help in Charlotte, where they're desperate for frontcourt help, but the Cats should have kept Herrmann and received a draft pick for their troubles. Grade: C-
For Detroit: This just in -- Joe Dumars knows what he's doing. Mohammed was dead weight to them, the fifth big in a four-man rotation. Converting him into two expiring contracts was good enough; the fact that one of those expirings (Herrmann) can really play is even better. Surprisingly, he hasn't moved past Jarvis Hayes in the rotation yet. Brezec was later converted into the mildly useful Juan Dixon. Grade: A
Nov. 20: Orlando acquires Brian Cook and Maurice Evans from L.A. Lakers in exchange for Trevor Ariza
For Los Angeles: Evans became superfluous with the emergence of Sasha Vujacic and the presence of Kobe Bryant. Cook has been redundant since the day they signed Vladimir Radmanovic. So they sent out two disposable pieces to get one thing they lacked -- an athletic high-flier at the small forward position. The fact that Ariza is 22, is easily the best of the three players, and has a cap-friendly contract made this a double no-brainer. Grade: A
For Orlando: Could they have tried harder to find a role for Ariza? Probably. Was upgrading their situation at the 2 more important than fitting Ariza's non-shooting ways into their space-the-floor system? Absolutely.
Cook hasn't played much but he can help too as another floor-spacer -- certainly he's better than James Augustine, providing a bit of a cure for a critical lack of depth up front. Thus, while I like this trade a little better from L.A.'s end, this is another deal that clearly helped both teams. Grade: B
John Hollinger writes for ESPN Insider. To e-mail him, click here.
So we get the info on the protection on the pick even if we don't know the full detailed version of the protection.
I would have liked a pick more protected than that, something like top22 or top24 protected. With an average season next year, Spurs could end up losing a pick in the late 10s.
Anyway, Spurs haven't been stupid enough to trade an unprotected first round pick.
A good break down I must say.
btw. I'm surprised somebody even thought that Shaq will provide more defense into Arizona squad.
Losing Marion could kill Suns chances. This year or never.
Still I'm wondering why so many teams went into the risk with trades.
NO, Suns, Dallas
So we get the info on the protection on the pick even if we don't know the full detailed version of the protection.
I would have liked a pick more protected than that, something like top22 or top24 protected. With an average season next year, Spurs could end up losing a pick in the late 10s.
Anyway, Spurs haven't been stupid enough to trade an unprotected first round pick.
Not that I thought they would trade away an unprotected pick, but at least it's confirmed that they did not.
They're now just enough under that they can sign a veteran free agent for the prorated league minimum and still avoid the tax. Somebody like, I don't know ... Brent Barry?
Barkley brought up another good point about K. Thomas that was probably not lost on Pop: K. Thomas guards Duncan well.
That's good.
We can play against Duncan in the playoffs so good trade
That's good.
We can play against Duncan in the playoffs so good trade
You do realize he's saying that by acquiring Kurt Thomas, we're keeping him away from a team we might meet in the playoffs. So it's a double whammy, KT helps the Spurs, and keeps him from a team that could hurt us in the playoffs.
Booyah!Additionally, the trade takes San Antonio under the luxury tax line. In fact, here's the really crafty part: They're now just enough under that they can sign a veteran free agent for the prorated league minimum and still avoid the tax. Somebody like, I don't know ... Brent Barry?
RC Buford showing the kids how its done.
Like Seattle
How could we not keep other 100 players from other teams we could meet in the PO?
LOL, no, not like Seattle. Maybe Orlando makes a move. Dallas was supposedly thinking about trading for KT. Who knows, who cares? He helps the Spurs, he doesn't help some other contender. I'm pretty sure Presti was gonna move KT, better to us (esp if we get Barry back) than somebody else.
Feb. 20: Seattle trades Kurt Thomas to San Antonio for Brent Barry, Francisco Elson and a 2009 first-round pick
For Seattle: If you're keeping score, Sonics GM Sam Presti has now parlayed a single trade exception from the Rashard Lewis sign-and-trade into three first-round picks, with the latest coming from San Antonio in the Thomas deal. Getting the pick in 2009 rather than 2008 might be a shrewd move, too, if you buy that San Antonio's age problems could hit it hard next season; however, the pick is lottery-protected.
Barry has already been waived and Elson is a buyout candidate, incidentally, so the Sonics could save some money on that end too. Grade: A
For San Antonio: They needed another tough hombre in the frontcourt, especially with Robert Horry on the wane, and definitely got one in Thomas. He defends and can space the floor for Tim Duncan by hitting 15-footers from the free-throw line area, so in those respects he's a better version of Fabricio Oberto -- he just doesn't move without the ball like Oberto does.
The risk for San Antonio is that Barry will be bought out, sign with another team and start raining 3s on them in the playoffs. But with Barry sidelined by a calf problem, that's less of a risk -- if he'd been healthy the Spurs probably wouldn't have done this deal.
Additionally, the trade takes San Antonio under the luxury tax line. In fact, here's the really crafty part: They're now just enough under that they can sign a veteran free agent for the prorated league minimum and still avoid the tax. Somebody like, I don't know ... Brent Barry? Grade: A-
San Antonio pleads the fif.
you used to be smarter than that
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