Suns Open to Trading Number Six Pick for the Right Veteran Guard (ESPN)

[TimD]

https://s.hdnux.com/photos/01/00/62/73/16985815/3/gallery_medium.jpg


Who says no?

[duncan2k5]

If we don't ship DDR's ass out for that 6 pick, our FO needs to be fired!

[NASpurs]

BxatRWWngoM


Who says no?

Fixed your broken link.

And just Patty isn’t enough.

[XDT76]

Maybe they prefer patty? Lol

[RC_Drunkford]

that would be a dream come true. Give them 50 Mills and 19. Shit add 29 if you have to. Getting this net negative off the team and his contract off the books would be huge

[duncan2150]

They want a real PG, just forget this idea.

[Realdeal1]

Yeah I'm not going to get my hopes up for this

[cd98]

Eh, the sixth pick will suck. Almost guaranteed.

[duncan2k5]

Eh, the sixth pick will suck. Almost guaranteed.

Better than keeping DDR

[sananspursfan21]

I could see DeRozan and pieces maybe but otherwise, we wouldn’t sniff that 6th pick.

[k830713]

Suns - Mills + Murray + pick 19 + pick 29
Spurs - Jackson + pick 6

[cd98]

Better than keeping DDR

Chances are the number six pick will never be as good as DDR, regardless if you think he is trash. Trash can't consistently put up the numbers he has in the NBA. He may not be a superstar, but he has value and the 6 pick is mostly crap. Outside the top 3, I'm not sure why anyone moves up. Not saying there won't be good players in the draft, but most lottery players end up on the bench or out of the league very quickly.

[cd98]

Numbers:

Of the last 35 first overall picks, 77 percent of those players were future all stars. 2nd picks? 34%. 3rd pick? 49%. 4th pick? 29%. 5th pick? 31%. 6th pick? 20%. 7th pick? 20%. 8th pick? 11%.

So trading DDR for the 6 pick is really risky given that 80% of the time, the 6th pick has not been near as good as DDR is. Spurs should not bother trading down into the lottery unless there is a player that they like that slips past the top 5 picks. Lottery picks are too expensive and yield mostly failed players. There is a reason why perennial lottery teams never get better. It's because unless the tankers get the number one pick, it's bleak that they will get anything from that pick.

[Hoops Czar]

Non-spurs related threads should be posted downstairs.

[exstatic]

Suns - Mills + Murray + pick 19 + pick 29
Spurs - Jackson + pick 6

Uh, no. You don't throw in extra assets like Murray + 19 + 29 to get Jackson, a player they've been trying to flat out dump for months. He's pretty much a bust after two seasons, and has maturity issues, to boot. Doubt the Spurs would want him, other than maybe as a throw in.

Forget about dumping Patty. That dog won't hunt. Something like this might work, though.

SA sends DD to the Lakers. They get a second star, and keep #4 pick.

Lakers send Ball (+ something?) to PHO. They get their PG.

PHO sends #6 to us. We get a high pick and a HUGE trade exception.

[Spurs fever]

Pop will make sure DeMar retires a Spur.

[r0drig0lac]

They want a real PG, just forget this idea.

/thread

[duncan2k5]

Chances are the number six pick will never be as good as DDR, regardless if you think he is trash. Trash can't consistently put up the numbers he has in the NBA. He may not be a superstar, but he has value and the 6 pick is mostly crap. Outside the top 3, I'm not sure why anyone moves up. Not saying there won't be good players in the draft, but most lottery players end up on the bench or out of the league very quickly.

Having DDR off the team is more valuable than having him on... It's been that way his entire career

[DPG21920]

Uh, no. You don't throw in extra assets like Murray + 19 + 29 to get Jackson, a player they've been trying to flat out dump for months. He's pretty much a bust after two seasons, and has maturity issues, to boot. Doubt the Spurs would want him, other than maybe as a throw in.

Forget about dumping Patty. That dog won't hunt. Something like this might work, though.

SA sends DD to the Lakers. They get a second star, and keep #4 pick.

Lakers send Ball (+ something?) to PHO. They get their PG.

PHO sends #6 to us. We get a high pick and a HUGE trade exception.

This is the only type of scenario where I can see something happening. It’s unlikely Suns would want DeRozan directly; but a team with a young PG that wants to win now can make a 3 team deal work.

[duncan2k5]

You don't need to be an all star to bring value... If u can trade a loser like DDR for someone who ends up having a career like Mike Miller, or Bruce bowen, I'll be happy... Shit if we trade him for a second round pick I'll be exstatic

[Emperor]

Maybe we can offer Mills/Bertans/19th pick for Warren and their 6th?

[GreekSpursfan]

DDR is a point guard, really? Suns need a POINT GUARD. In a more serious note, i think they are targeting Mike Conley tbh.

[JeffDuncan]

Uh, no. You don't throw in extra assets like Murray + 19 + 29 to get Jackson, a player they've been trying to flat out dump for months. He's pretty much a bust after two seasons, and has maturity issues, to boot. Doubt the Spurs would want him, other than maybe as a throw in.

Forget about dumping Patty. That dog won't hunt. Something like this might work, though.

SA sends DD to the Lakers. They get a second star, and keep #4 pick.

Lakers send Ball (+ something?) to PHO. They get their PG.

PHO sends #6 to us. We get a high pick and a HUGE trade exception.

I like the concept, but especially after the Anthony Davis stuff I don't know about Pop and the Fakers doing a deal. Doubt it. Going through a team in the East might be more plausible.

[look_at_g_shred]

Sarver hates pop

[phxspurfan]

Eh, the sixth pick will suck. Almost guaranteed.

It will be someone like Rui Hoochiemama (aka the Japanese Tyler Hansbrough), which for some reason people on this board love. Probably because his name is Rui Hoochiemama.

[Hoops Czar]

Numbers:

Of the last 35 first overall picks, 77 percent of those players were future all stars. 2nd picks? 34%. 3rd pick? 49%. 4th pick? 29%. 5th pick? 31%. 6th pick? 20%. 7th pick? 20%. 8th pick? 11%.

So trading DDR for the 6 pick is really risky given that 80% of the time, the 6th pick has not been near as good as DDR is. Spurs should not bother trading down into the lottery unless there is a player that they like that slips past the top 5 picks. Lottery picks are too expensive and yield mostly failed players. There is a reason why perennial lottery teams never get better. It's because unless the tankers get the number one pick, it's bleak that they will get anything from that pick.

No team is trading a lottery pick for one year of DeRozan.

[JeffDuncan]

Sarver hates pop

When did Pop piss on his wheaties?

[DPG21920]

No team is trading a lottery pick for one year of DeRozan.

It’s more likely 2 years vs 1.

[exstatic]

I like the concept, but especially after the Anthony Davis stuff I don't know about Pop and the Fakers doing a deal. Doubt it. Going through a team in the East might be more plausible.

Pop's beef was always with Magic, and his tampering/cheating.

If they're getting a 21/6/6 player, and shipping out Ball, and maybe another small asset (Hart?), (and keeping the #4 pick) I think the Lakers might play ball.

[exstatic]

Sarver hates pop

More than losing?

I'm not sure how much an owner, even a meddler like Sarver, actually is involved in the process, but he'd be dealing with RC. Pop would approve/disapprove, but wouldn't directly be involved in the process.

[timtonymanu]

Pop is not trading Patty. :lol

He so embarrassingly vouches for him like he’s part of the Big 3 and his “culture.” Pop would rather trade Murray or White at this point.

[RC_Drunkford]

It will be someone like Rui Hoochiemama (aka the Japanese Tyler Hansbrough), which for some reason people on this board love. Probably because his name is Rui Hoochiemama.

:lmao

#6 pick is too high for Hachimura, more like 10-14

[DPG21920]

Look, it’s going to be tough to get a deal done period. Especially with the Lakers/Suns. The framework makes sense, but there are still a lot of variables and hurdles (namely, LA isnt doing anything until AFTER free agency; DeRozan isn’t good enough, even keeping their pick, to forego free agency)

[JeffDuncan]

Pop's beef was always with Magic, and his tampering/cheating.

If they're getting a 21/6/6 player, and shipping out Ball, and maybe another small asset (Hart?), (and keeping the #4 pick) I think the Lakers might play ball.

Ball + Hart is about $10.7 million. DDR is $27.7 mil. It's going to take some juggling.

[DPG21920]

Ball + Hart is about $10.7 million. DDR is $27.7 mil. It's going to take some juggling.

Just depends on what LA does in free agency. LA has a ton of cap space. If they make DeRozan the priority swapping Ball for DeRozan works easily.

[Hoops Czar]

It’s more likely 2 years vs 1.
Pretty sure DeRozan won't opt in to play for a lottery team,. He'll get max or close to max on the open market from a contender or an entry level playoff team looking to contend.

[DPG21920]

Pretty sure DeRozan won't opt in to play for a lottery team,. He'll get max or close to max on the open market from a contender or an entry level playoff team looking to contend.

LA wouldn’t be a lottery team with him and Lebron. Plus, he will get max just fine whether he opts in or out so no reason to really not take 28M.

[exstatic]

Ball + Hart is about $10.7 million. DDR is $27.7 mil. It's going to take some juggling.

LA has cap room to absorb DD's entire contract. Not sure of PHO's situation. They probably have some room, but if not, I'd not be averse to taking on a short contract or two to make the deal work.

[DPG21920]

LA has cap room to absorb DD's entire contract. Not sure of PHO's situation. They probably have some room, but if not, I'd not be averse to taking on a short contract or two to make the deal work.

PHX has plenty of cap space to absorb Lonzo.

[Hoops Czar]

LA wouldn’t be a lottery team with him and Lebron. Plus, he will get max just fine whether he opts in or out so no reason to really not take 28M.
LAL doesn't want him (the article posted awhile back was hypothetical) and they aren't going to jeopardize their chances of trading away assets that could be used to trade for Davis. Three team trades are very tricky and hard to pull off. That's why you see very few of them.

[DPG21920]

LAL doesn't want him (the article posted awhile back was hypothetical) and they aren't going to jeopardize their chances of trading away assets that could be used to trade for Davis. Three team trades are very tricky and hard to pull off. That's why you see very few of them.

They happen plenty; trades in general are hard to pull off though I agree. But that article while hypothetical was not totally rooted in nothing. Windhorst is plugged into Lebron.

[DC23]

Meh I just don't see the Suns and Spurs doing business together, but hey maybe I'm wrong. The Suns are definitely looking to dump Josh Jackson and TJ Warren too.

[exstatic]

Just depends on what LA does in free agency. LA has a ton of cap space. If they make DeRozan the priority swapping Ball for DeRozan works easily.

DD would be a sure thing, the proverbial bird in the hand. They've had a shitty time trying to get FAs to sign there. Playing with LeBron is difficult, and then throw in the fact that they didn't even make the playoffs last year, and it's a tough sell.

[exstatic]

LAL doesn't want him (the article posted awhile back was hypothetical) and they aren't going to jeopardize their chances of trading away assets that could be used to trade for Davis. Three team trades are very tricky and hard to pull off. That's why you see very few of them.

They're not getting Davis. The ONLY shot they had at that was winning the lottery, and N.O. won it instead. They just flat don't have the assets to match Boston.

[DPG21920]

DD would be a sure thing, the proverbial bird in the hand. They've had a shitty time trying to get FAs to sign there. Playing with LeBron is difficult, and then throw in the fact that they didn't even make the playoffs last year, and it's a tough sell.

Sure, but that option will still be there even if they strike out. So you don’t give up the attempt at bat.

[Dverde]

Suns need a actual PG not a smaller shooting Devin Booker.

[FkLA]

https://s.hdnux.com/photos/01/00/62/73/16985815/3/gallery_medium.jpg


Who says no?

Pop

[Mugen]

:lol Why do people keep putting Patty in trades where he has positive value?

Because of his play and contract, he legit has negative value....even in a dream world where Pop would actually part with him, we'd have to probably start with attaching the 29th pick to shed his contract ...

[ceperez]

Opportunity Knocks!!!!

Either trade Murray or trade DeRozan

[exstatic]

Sure, but that option will still be there even if they strike out. So you don’t give up the attempt at bat.

Those picks will all be made by then, and not necessarily who the Spurs would want at #6. It's asymetric. You either do it during the draft or not at all.

[DPG21920]

Those picks will all be made by then, and not necessarily who the Spurs would want at #6. It's asymetric. You either do it during the draft or not at all.

That’s my point. It’s highly unlikely a deal gets done for that exact reason. I don’t see LA giving up in FA before it even starts for DeRozan. Perhaps they do, but I wouldn’t bet on it.

[cd98]

Having DDR off the team is more valuable than having him on... It's been that way his entire career

Anyone that thinks that Demar DeRozan has no value and is no good and therefore is better to get rid of for nothing is woefully misguided on NBA level talent.

[timvp]

Forget about dumping Patty. That dog won't hunt. Something like this might work, though.

SA sends DD to the Lakers. They get a second star, and keep #4 pick.

Lakers send Ball (+ something?) to PHO. They get their PG.

PHO sends #6 to us. We get a high pick and a HUGE trade exception.

Yeah, that would be the most realistic scenario. But, again, it would require the Lakers to be really, really, really stupid. Work for years to open up cap room and then use a big chunk of it before free agency even begins? That would take a special kind of stupid that I'm not sure even the Lakers have achieved yet.

[TDomination]

if it was this Patty then maybe.

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Patty+Mills+2014+NBA+Finals+Game+Five+sGgfkT3yCu8l .jpg

[Dennis the Menace]

if it was this Patty then maybe.

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Patty+Mills+2014+NBA+Finals+Game+Five+sGgfkT3yCu8l .jpg

“There’s no pressure to perform.” - Patty Mills

[DavidTheGoliath]

ST: Patty sucks!
Also ST: trade him for a lottery pick straight up

Wtf are you people smoking?

[diceman]

Numbers:

Of the last 35 first overall picks, 77 percent of those players were future all stars. 2nd picks? 34%. 3rd pick? 49%. 4th pick? 29%. 5th pick? 31%. 6th pick? 20%. 7th pick? 20%. 8th pick? 11%.

So trading DDR for the 6 pick is really risky given that 80% of the time, the 6th pick has not been near as good as DDR is. Spurs should not bother trading down into the lottery unless there is a player that they like that slips past the top 5 picks. Lottery picks are too expensive and yield mostly failed players. There is a reason why perennial lottery teams never get better. It's because unless the tankers get the number one pick, it's bleak that they will get anything from that pick.

This! I wouldn't trade DDR + pieces unless it nets a top 3 draft pick. Like cd stated, it is risky and those high lotto picks are $$$. Sure DDR is flawed, but unless there is a true all-star or Spurs can shed Patty's contract as part of package, or something crazy happens like the Spurs can move into the top 3, I just hope DDR gets more comfy in the system and develops a three.

[DPG21920]

So if CHA came around and offered #12 + Bismack + Marvin Williams for DeRozan + Beli you would not do that?

[Chinook]

Fans on RealGM are asking about White and 19 for 6. It's temping. If they tossed in a Mills/Johnson swap or took 29 instead of 19, I'd do it. They'd get that impact player and open up minutes for Walker while potentially opening up a max slot in 2020.

[Chinook]

So if CHA came around and offered #12 + Bismack + Marvin Williams for DeRozan + Beli you would not do that?

Depends on who is at 12. If it's a guy who could come in and deserve minutes right away, it could make sense. But moving DMDR for a pick likely pushes them farther away from contention.

[FkLA]

Fans on RealGM are asking about White and 19 for 6. It's temping. If they tossed in a Mills/Johnson swap or took 29 instead of 19, I'd do it. They'd get that impact player and open up minutes for Walker while potentially opening up a max slot in 2020.

Give them Instagram Baller instead and I'm in, tbh.

[DPG21920]

Depends on who is at 12. If it's a guy who could come in and deserve minutes right away, it could make sense. But moving DMDR for a pick likely pushes them farther away from contention.

This is true, but I think there is a balance with win-building. SA made the playoffs without DeRozan already. Adding Lonnie + White breaking out to that team (Since Murray was playing that year) in addition to Poeltl and free agency? I think it’s still a playoff team but now with a clearer future with a shot at better youth and cap space.

[DPG21920]

To me, while I definitely want to be good right now, it would be tough to pass on say: Rui, Little & another player + cap space next year to keep DeRozan.

I don’t know how much worse the team would be next year in the big scheme of things (maybe a 2nd round team vs a WCF team?) and if that is worth passing up on building a young core with the chance to add a better fitting vet as early as next year.

[Mugen]

I'd much rather give up Dejounte than White tbh. And #6 only makes sense if Hunter is still available.

[DPG21920]

Depends on who is at 12. If it's a guy who could come in and deserve minutes right away, it could make sense. But moving DMDR for a pick likely pushes them farther away from contention.

And also Marvin Williams for DeRozan I think helps too - wouldn’t totally kill next year.

[TD 21]

Numbers:


Of the last 35 first overall picks, 77 percent of those players were future all stars. 2nd picks? 34%. 3rd pick? 49%. 4th pick? 29%. 5th pick? 31%. 6th pick? 20%. 7th pick? 20%. 8th pick? 11%.

So trading DDR for the 6 pick is really risky given that 80% of the time, the 6th pick has not been near as good as DDR is. Spurs should not bother trading down into the lottery unless there is a player that they like that slips past the top 5 picks. Lottery picks are too expensive and yield mostly failed players. There is a reason why perennial lottery teams never get better. It's because unless the tankers get the number one pick, it's bleak that they will get anything from that pick.

Good work . . . too bad this ignores the fact that DeRozan is a pseudo All-Star, who recently annually made it on a combination of the strength of the Raptors' recently annually strong record (like the Spurs, they were regularly worse with him on floor and best with Lowry + the 2nd unit), the East being weak and counting stats continuing to be overvalued.

It also ignores his poor fit on this roster and the fact that he'll be minimizing on ball reps for Murray, White, Walker.



Fans on RealGM are asking about White and 19 for 6. It's temping. If they tossed in a Mills/Johnson swap or took 29 instead of 19, I'd do it. They'd get that impact player and open up minutes for Walker while potentially opening up a max slot in 2020.

It's only tempting if either Hunter is somewhat unexpectedly available at 6 or the Spurs are high on Reddish.

Something like White, 19 and 49 for Hunter or Reddish and Okobo or Melton, is at least worthy of strong consideration. Murray instead of White would be preferable though.

[TDMVPDPOY]

6pick is better then nothing

with the right development and minutes, that players learning curve is upto them to take that opportunity

and we all know pop with rookies in their first year, be lucky to get scrub minutes or even playoff minutes..fck that clown

[spurraider21]

i wouldnt give up derrick white to move up. but i wouldnt package dejounte with 19 either, unless we're getting into the top 5

the potential of a white/murray backcourt is what makes the team compelling going forward, imo

if we can dump derozan for any first round pick it would be a big win imo. his inability to shoot and his poor defense make it incredibly difficult to build a good, cohesive starting unit

[Mugen]

Charlotte with Batum and the 12th....Minny with Covington / Dieng and the 11th.....

Those are the only realistic trade partners I could see for Derozan and I'm using realistic very loosely in this situation tbh......

[RC_Drunkford]

nah I wouldn't give up any of the young guys. I don't think there are a lot of players in this draft after the 5th pick who have a higher ceiling than White, Walker or Murray. Besides that it would be a huge gamble. Moving DeRozan is a possibility but would have to be for the 4th pick, nothing lower than that

[buttsR4rebounding]

I think the Spurs are a playoff team without DeRozan and the fact that his drop in production from regular season to playoffs is one of the biggest for all current players makes him expendable for a first round pick.

[Dennis the Menace]

Just trade Derozan, our 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8 & #10 (Rui & Little) then call it a day.

[cjw]

Chances are the number six pick will never be as good as DDR, regardless if you think he is trash. Trash can't consistently put up the numbers he has in the NBA. He may not be a superstar, but he has value and the 6 pick is mostly crap. Outside the top 3, I'm not sure why anyone moves up. Not saying there won't be good players in the draft, but most lottery players end up on the bench or out of the league very quickly.

Not perfect, but in the average draft the sixth pick will contribute 18 or so wins in their first five seasons.

Demar produced about six win shares last year so 30 over five years. But the caveats:

- He’s not likely to improve but was 9+ last three years in Toronto
- The 538 analysis doesn’t adjust for minutes played
- Sixth pick will be a lot cheaper, and open up cap space ($5 million salary or so over first three years). But need to find a place to use that cap space...

https://fivethirtyeight-com.cdn.ampproject.org/i/s/fivethirtyeight.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/silver-feature-nbalottery-11.png

[DPG21920]

^ Not to mention that SA has players to help soak up some of the usage; it would not all be on the pick to replace DeRozan. Murray/White/Lonnie can take some of that responsibility; not a guarantee they do better with their touches but the point is it’s not all on the pick(s)

[RC_Drunkford]

Just trade Derozan, our 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8 & #10 (Rui & Little) then call it a day.

now that would be a great trade

[r0drig0lac]

Just trade Derozan, our 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8 & #10 (Rui & Little) then call it a day.

yes, please

[GusT15]

Just trade Derozan, our 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8 & #10 (Rui & Little) then call it a day.

Can we get Prince as well in that trade? It's not like they are actually using him.

[sananspursfan21]

if it was this Patty then maybe.

http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Patty+Mills+2014+NBA+Finals+Game+Five+sGgfkT3yCu8l .jpg

Boy I miss bald Patty

[FkLA]

“There’s no pressure to perform.” - Patty Mills

Wait, did he actually say this at one point?

[GusT15]

Wait, did he actually say this at one point?


Patty Mills is richer now than he’s ever been. Four months ago he agreed to the financial deal of a lifetime, and he believes he deserved it.
“I was rewarded for the years before,” Mills said. “This is a fresh start. There’s no pressure to perform.”

https://www.expressnews.com/sports/columnists/mike_finger/article/Mike-Finger-1030-12315982.php

[Dennis the Menace]

Just trade Derozan, our 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8 & #10 (Rui & Little) then call it a day.

Thats option A


Option B & C: Knicks are rumored to be exploring trading #3 pick to Atlanta for #8 #10.

A: Derozan, 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8, #10 (Rui, Little)

or if 3 way deal
B: Trade Derozan to Atlanta for #3 pick (Hunter)
C: Trade Derozan to Knicks for #8, #10 (Rui, Little)

[BatManu20]

Suns - Mills + Murray + pick 19 + pick 29
Spurs - Jackson + pick 6

Lol PATFO would never

[Dennis the Menace]

Spurs would essentially be getting 3 first round draft picks in the Top 10 for Kawhi & Green in the long run (#8, #10, #9 Poetl). Would make me feel a lot better about what transpired

[Millennial_Messiah]

Chances are the number six pick will never be as good as DDR, regardless if you think he is trash. Trash can't consistently put up the numbers he has in the NBA. He may not be a superstar, but he has value and the 6 pick is mostly crap. Outside the top 3, I'm not sure why anyone moves up. Not saying there won't be good players in the draft, but most lottery players end up on the bench or out of the league very quickly.

yeah, this isn't football. It's a superstar driven league and having a bunch of second tier players means a ceiling of first round exit.

[FkLA]

https://www.expressnews.com/sports/columnists/mike_finger/article/Mike-Finger-1030-12315982.php

Jesus how did I miss that. I don't know whether to laugh or rage about it. It explains a lot though smh.

[talkspurs]

Since everyone wants to get rid of Patty and Suns want to get rid of Jackson and want a PG. What about mills for jackson and their 32nd pick. this would give them a vet to tutor the young PG and get rid of a player they want to. It gets rid of a player we want to get rid of a fills a need (if he pans out). Biggest problem would be convincing Pop of this.

[Marrow]

jackson's a headcase...we don't need him

[exstatic]

Can we get Prince as well in that trade? It's not like they are actually using him.

:lol. ATL laughs and hangs up on the original trade. There’s no way you’re getting that, let alone another player.

[CGD]

Maybe we can offer Mills/Bertans/19th pick for Warren and their 6th?

Not bad actually. That Warren deal goes one more year than Patty’s deal, so the Suns save 12M. Monty Williams might also see some value is bringing in some stable Spurs guys.

[Roscoe P. Coltrane]

Eh, the sixth pick will suck. Almost guaranteed.

[Roscoe P. Coltrane]

Uh, no. You don't throw in extra assets like Murray + 19 + 29 to get Jackson, a player they've been trying to flat out dump for months. He's pretty much a bust after two seasons, and has maturity issues, to boot. Doubt the Spurs would want him, other than maybe as a throw in.

Forget about dumping Patty. That dog won't hunt. Something like this might work, though.t

SA sends DD to the Lakers. They get a second star, and keep #4 pick.

Lakers send Ball (+ something?) to PHO. They get their PG.

PHO sends #6 to us. We get a high pick and a HUGE trade exception.The Lakers 4th pick is going to New Orleans AD.

[Xx_SpursNation_xX]

Who is assumed to be the sixth pick?

[Chinook]

Since everyone wants to get rid of Patty and Suns want to get rid of Jackson and want a PG. What about mills for jackson and their 32nd pick. this would give them a vet to tutor the young PG and get rid of a player they want to. It gets rid of a player we want to get rid of a fills a need (if he pans out). Biggest problem would be convincing Pop of this.

I've been a fan of Jackson's for a while. I'd certainly want him if it doesn't cost a pick. That takes care of the sneaky small-wing hole the team might try to fill with Langford, Porter or Johnson. Then they can either use 29 on a center or more comfortably trade 19 and 29 to move up for that PF. Having 32 in the back pocket would make it even better. Don't think Phoenix will go for it, though. I think they may well trade Jackson for a matching expiring like Bertans or even Beli, but they aren't paying to dump him, especially not for a worse contract.

[cd021]

Just trade Derozan, our 19, 29 to Atlanta for #8 & #10 (Rui & Little) then call it a day.
Weird trade; why would a rebuilding team want a 30 year floor raising player and give up 2 top 10 pick's for the privilege? 19 and 29 does nothing for them, they could just stay bad, use those two picks and be in the lottery again next season.

[cd021]

The Lakers 4th pick is going to New Orleans AD.

Seems fairly clear that New Orleans doesn't want to ship him there, if they end up doing so then it would probably be at the trade deadline.

[cutewizard]

do it RC

[monty4329]

Suns - Mills + Murray + pick 19 + pick 29
Spurs - Jackson + pick 6

What????

Money considerations aside, you basically value Jackson more than Murray+Mills? Have you ever watched a Suns game?

[monty4329]

Chances are the number six pick will never be as good as DDR, regardless if you think he is trash. Trash can't consistently put up the numbers he has in the NBA. He may not be a superstar, but he has value and the 6 pick is mostly crap. Outside the top 3, I'm not sure why anyone moves up. Not saying there won't be good players in the draft, but most lottery players end up on the bench or out of the league very quickly.

Totally agree. As much as I'd like DDR traded, there is no way this year's 6th pick will ever be as good as DDR. At least in the short term (2yrs).

And anyway we have already too many young guys and too little minutes to spread.

[monty4329]

Fans on RealGM are asking about White and 19 for 6. It's temping. If they tossed in a Mills/Johnson swap or took 29 instead of 19, I'd do it. They'd get that impact player and open up minutes for Walker while potentially opening up a max slot in 2020.

Say #19 is worth nothing (not true), that scenario values White as a #6 pick or less. And give zero value to White's development.

Doesn't make any sense at all.

[monty4329]

jackson's a headcase...we don't need him

Exactly.

[cutewizard]

Samanic, get him

[exstatic]

The Lakers 4th pick is going to New Orleans AD.

Nope. This is a three pick draft, and two of them won't likely be as good as Tatum. Boston gets AD. They just have way better assets than the Lakers empty cupboard.

[slick'81]

We arent getting shit for derozan

[talkspurs]

I've been a fan of Jackson's for a while. I'd certainly want him if it doesn't cost a pick. That takes care of the sneaky small-wing hole the team might try to fill with Langford, Porter or Johnson. Then they can either use 29 on a center or more comfortably trade 19 and 29 to move up for that PF. Having 32 in the back pocket would make it even better. Don't think Phoenix will go for it, though. I think they may well trade Jackson for a matching expiring like Bertans or even Beli, but they aren't paying to dump him, especially not for a worse contract.

I more went of a position of need and it is only one extra year. I do understand your point of them not wanting to pay to get rid of Jackson but they already have so many SG. I would easily do Beli for Jackson but would try and have them take mills instead as we have so many PG. With our Picks I would try and get a SF and PF. One I would like to get is Okere. I know he would be out a year but would give us a jakcson replacement if he doesnt work out or he wants to leave. We could either get him with 29 or the Suns.
Jackson reminds me a lot of Kawhi. I know people hate that but he is a defense player that is not a great shooter. Hopefully we could make him better but if not it would not cost much.

[exstatic]

I more went of a position of need and it is only one extra year. I do understand your point of them not wanting to pay to get rid of Jackson but they already have so many SG. I would easily do Beli for Jackson but would try and have them take mills instead as we have so many PG. With our Picks I would try and get a SF and PF. One I would like to get is Okere. I know he would be out a year but would give us a jakcson replacement if he doesnt work out or he wants to leave. We could either get him with 29 or the Suns.
Jackson reminds me a lot of Kawhi. I know people hate that but he is a defense player that is not a great shooter. Hopefully we could make him better but if not it would not cost much.

He's a headcase who ran away from the police IN CUFFS. That alone would make the Spurs disinterested. He's also not good at ANY shooting. His career FG% is 41.5. Awful. His career FT% is 65. Awful. His career 3G% is 29.4. Damn near awful, but we'll just call it bad. I think they're going to have a hard time finding a taker. As a #4 overall pick, his contract skyrockets in the next two years, $7M, and $8.9M for a player who hasn't shown much progress. If he were just having on court issues, you might take a chance, but he seems to be a real dumbass.

[lmbebo]

He's a headcase who ran away from the police IN CUFFS. That alone would make the Spurs disinterested. He's also not good at ANY shooting. His career FG% is 41.5. Awful. His career FT% is 65. Awful. His career 3G% is 29.4. Damn near awful, but we'll just call it bad. I think they're going to have a hard time finding a taker. As a #4 overall pick, his contract skyrockets in the next two years, $7M, and $8.9M for a player who hasn't shown much progress. If he were just having on court issues, you might take a chance, but he seems to be a real dumbass.

Supposedly spurs had interest in him pre-draft. But a lot of red flags right now.

[Desert Spur]

This guy is dialed in to the Suns organization:

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48003849453_ee380fa0bd_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2g8Wh1M)

[talkspurs]

He's a headcase who ran away from the police IN CUFFS. That alone would make the Spurs disinterested. He's also not good at ANY shooting. His career FG% is 41.5. Awful. His career FT% is 65. Awful. His career 3G% is 29.4. Damn near awful, but we'll just call it bad. I think they're going to have a hard time finding a taker. As a #4 overall pick, his contract skyrockets in the next two years, $7M, and $8.9M for a player who hasn't shown much progress. If he were just having on court issues, you might take a chance, but he seems to be a real dumbass.

You could say the same thing about Stephen Jackson when the spurs took him back. For the little risk it would be worth it. Kawhi was not a good shooter when he was drafted. From what I have seen most of his off court stuff has been minor. I understand Spurs culture but you also have some of the other players doing things that was not spurs type. AD had some minor issues also. If you want someone that makes no mistakes you are going to have to give up something of higher value. With where we are drafting I doubt we would get anything close to him in the draft. If he does not work in the first year we can let him walk. They fact that we have people arguing both sides means it is a fairer trade then mills for the 6th pick.

[DPG21920]

Speaking of trades, since there is a logjam, would anyone trade Mills for JR Smith? Could play him at SF and if hes a dummy can waive him for only 3.5M and have Mills money off the books next year

[mo7888]

Speaking of trades, since there is a logjam, would anyone trade Mills for JR Smith? Could play him at SF and if hes a dummy can waive him for only 3.5M and have Mills money off the books next year

I wouldn't. The chemistry risk is to great for a diminishing player like JR. If this was the JR from 3 years ago I would.

[BackHome]

If the Flakers loose AD to Boston and KY stays with Raptors and Kevin end up in Boston or New York then they need to land Klay or DEROZZ. They can’t go through another season with out making noise they have to sign a big name person.

The question is besides the 4th pick what else would you want from The Flakers?

[slick'81]

If the Flakers loose AD to Boston and KY stays with Raptors and Kevin end up in Boston or New York then they need to land Klay or DEROZZ. They can’t go through another season with out making noise they have to sign a big name person.

The question is besides the 4th pick what else would you want from The Flakers?


Nothing except lonzo sucks and bloodclot ingram

[Kurgan]

If the Flakers loose AD to Boston and KY stays with Raptors and Kevin end up in Boston or New York then they need to land Klay or DEROZZ. They can’t go through another season with out making noise they have to sign a big name person.

The question is besides the 4th pick what else would you want from The Flakers?

The problem is all those moves would happen after the draft. Would Spurs still be interested in the 4th pick if it's somebody we don't want(another guard). The 4th pick is only enticing if the Lakers choose a guy we could use like Hunter. The issue is Lakers aren't likely to draft a forward since they already have a logjam of them on their roster.

[rascal]

White and #19 for Mikal Bridges and #6

[exstatic]

You could say the same thing about Stephen Jackson when the spurs took him back. For the little risk it would be worth it. Kawhi was not a good shooter when he was drafted. From what I have seen most of his off court stuff has been minor. I understand Spurs culture but you also have some of the other players doing things that was not spurs type. AD had some minor issues also. If you want someone that makes no mistakes you are going to have to give up something of higher value. With where we are drafting I doubt we would get anything close to him in the draft. If he does not work in the first year we can let him walk. They fact that we have people arguing both sides means it is a fairer trade then mills for the 6th pick.

They didn’t ‘take back’ Stephen Jackson, they took back a contract that matched RJs, but was a year shorter. Pop suspected that there could be trouble down the line, and was VERY clear in his phone call after the trade. It consisted of one sentence: “There will be no discussion of an extension”. He barely lasted over a year before they cut him loose. That’s a poor example to use as an example of why they should bring JJ aboard.

Kawhi shot 45% from the field, and 75% from the FT line, giving indication that his shot could be worked with. Poor FT shooting is a strong negative marker for long range shooting. JJ shot poorly across the board, as stated in my post above.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Give them Mills, Forbes and the Raptors pick. Seems fair.

[talkspurs]

They didn’t ‘take back’ Stephen Jackson, they took back a contract that matched RJs, but was a year shorter. Pop suspected that there could be trouble down the line, and was VERY clear in his phone call after the trade. It consisted of one sentence: “There will be no discussion of an extension”. He barely lasted over a year before they cut him loose. That’s a poor example to use as an example of why they should bring JJ aboard.

Kawhi shot 45% from the field, and 75% from the FT line, giving indication that his shot could be worked with. Poor FT shooting is a strong negative marker for long range shooting. JJ shot poorly across the board, as stated in my post above.

I dont see why Jackson is a bad example as you could also say the same thing about mills. Jackson contract is shorter and cheaper then mills. RJ was not causing problems so cant say they were getting rid of him. He was not playing up to his contract but neither is mills. Pop may have known some of the issues with Jackson but he did go after him. If it was to get a shorter contract they would not have had to attach the first round pick. nothing I have ever seen has mentioned that they wanted to get rid of Jefferson. If it was that they could have gone after others but they wanted Jack.

If you go to college then Jackson shot better then Kawhi except ft. JJ 51.3 FG 37.8 3s and 56.6 FT. KL 44.4 FG 29.1 3s 75.9 FT and that is his better year of the two on FT and 3s. He was not a great shooter comming out of college. The Spurs did a lot to help his shot.

[james evans]

Eh, the sixth pick will suck. Almost guaranteed.
There are thousands of kids coming out of college every season. If a team can’t find something at #6 then it’s a problem with the scouting

[Thomas82]

Who is assumed to be the sixth pick?

The 3 that I've seen at that spot in most mocks are Cam Reddish, Jarrett Culver, and Coby White.

[RC_Drunkford]

I dont see why Jackson is a bad example as you could also say the same thing about mills. Jackson contract is shorter and cheaper then mills. RJ was not causing problems so cant say they were getting rid of him. He was not playing up to his contract but neither is mills. Pop may have known some of the issues with Jackson but he did go after him. If it was to get a shorter contract they would not have had to attach the first round pick. nothing I have ever seen has mentioned that they wanted to get rid of Jefferson. If it was that they could have gone after others but they wanted Jack.

If you go to college then Jackson shot better then Kawhi except ft. JJ 51.3 FG 37.8 3s and 56.6 FT. KL 44.4 FG 29.1 3s 75.9 FT and that is his better year of the two on FT and 3s. He was not a great shooter comming out of college. The Spurs did a lot to help his shot.

the problem is you're thinking about basketball. PATFO thinks about Coffee Gang. There's no way they would trade a good locker room guy for the exact opposite.

[Nathan89]

Suns have to go full Patfo to make a trade for any assets on the Spurs.

[exstatic]

I dont see why Jackson is a bad example as you could also say the same thing about mills. Jackson contract is shorter and cheaper then mills. RJ was not causing problems so cant say they were getting rid of him. He was not playing up to his contract but neither is mills. Pop may have known some of the issues with Jackson but he did go after him. If it was to get a shorter contract they would not have had to attach the first round pick. nothing I have ever seen has mentioned that they wanted to get rid of Jefferson. If it was that they could have gone after others but they wanted Jack.

If you go to college then Jackson shot better then Kawhi except ft. JJ 51.3 FG 37.8 3s and 56.6 FT. KL 44.4 FG 29.1 3s 75.9 FT and that is his better year of the two on FT and 3s. He was not a great shooter comming out of college. The Spurs did a lot to help his shot.

They most certainly WERE getting rid of Jefferson. As you stated, he wasn’t playing up to his contract. He was also in Kawhis way. Your premise that they were actually interested inJackson is also flawed, your reason being that they attached a pick to the deal. They attached a pick, because they were essentially dumping an extra year of salary, to the tune of $11M, on Golden State.

[widowmaker]

Sacrifice Defrozen for the 6 pick and Forbes.

[slick'81]

Sacrifice Defrozen for the 6 pick and Forbes.

nobody wants dd

[Dverde]

Sacrifice Defrozen for the 6 pick and Forbes.

To trade DDR would mean trading for him was a mistake. PATFO will never do it.

[CGD]

Bill Simmons said Lonzo possible trade here. Gives Lakers 4 and 6 to throw at Nola for Davis

[talkspurs]

They most certainly WERE getting rid of Jefferson. As you stated, he wasn’t playing up to his contract. He was also in Kawhis way. Your premise that they were actually interested inJackson is also flawed, your reason being that they attached a pick to the deal. They attached a pick, because they were essentially dumping an extra year of salary, to the tune of $11M, on Golden State.

Rj was already being benched by that point. Everything I have ever seen was the trade was to get jackson. Even it was strictly to get rid of Jefferson for not playing up to contract why would they not do it again since Patty is not playing up to his contract. the situation is very similar.

[exstatic]

Bill Simmons said Lonzo possible trade here. Gives Lakers 4 and 6 to throw at Nola for Davis

Why on Earth would N.O. want so many top ten picks in one draft, let alone a shallow, three player draft like this one? Picks are too uncertain. Tatum is a star ready to burst onto the scene. LA has no one even close. Boston can flip the #14 this year, and the future Memphis pick that they are owed either in 2020 or 2021(unprotected).

[exstatic]

Rj was already being benched by that point. Everything I have ever seen was the trade was to get jackson. Even it was strictly to get rid of Jefferson for not playing up to contract why would they not do it again since Patty is not playing up to his contract. the situation is very similar.

The situation isn't even remotely similar. SA was just entering the final 1/3 of the Big Three era, and were competitive for a title. The next three playoff runs were WCF, Finals, Ring. The cap and tax were also MUCH lower. They literally could not afford to carry a $11M bench player.

Let me ask you this. If they were after Jackson, and I don't believe it, why would Pop get him on the phone while he was still in transit, and tell him there would be no extension? If you want a player, you usually want to keep them, don't you? That's kind of the opposite of what you do to keep a player.

[CGD]

Why on Earth would N.O. want so many top ten picks in one draft, let alone a shallow, three player draft like this one? Picks are too uncertain. Tatum is a star ready to burst onto the scene. LA has no one even close. Boston can flip the #14 this year, and the future Memphis pick that they are owed either in 2020 or 2021(unprotected).

I guess the theory goes that Lakers are rapidly on the outside track of the AD sweepstakes, and this is their last ditch play. Their young guys are seen as duds and perhaps a pick is more desirable, etc

[dbestpro]

Bill Simmons said Lonzo possible trade here. Gives Lakers 4 and 6 to throw at Nola for Davis

Ball could fetch a number one pick but not anybody in the top ten.

[james evans]

Pretty sure DeRozan won't opt in to play for a lottery team,. He'll get max or close to max on the open market from a contender or an entry level playoff team looking to contend.
What team in their right mind other than the Knicks would give Derozan max?

[superbigtime]

they will never trade derozan.

they will never trade mills.

[talkspurs]

The situation isn't even remotely similar. SA was just entering the final 1/3 of the Big Three era, and were competitive for a title. The next three playoff runs were WCF, Finals, Ring. The cap and tax were also MUCH lower. They literally could not afford to carry a $11M bench player.

Let me ask you this. If they were after Jackson, and I don't believe it, why would Pop get him on the phone while he was still in transit, and tell him there would be no extension? If you want a player, you usually want to keep them, don't you? That's kind of the opposite of what you do to keep a player.

Because Jackson had already talked about an extension. The Spurs also knew the issues he could cause. They also knew what he could bring to the table. If he was good then he is a better player then RJ.

[spurraider21]

Charlotte with Batum and the 12th....Minny with Covington / Dieng and the 11th.....

Those are the only realistic trade partners I could see for Derozan and I'm using realistic very loosely in this situation tbh......
this isn't 2013 batum anymore. dude's worse than derozan and has a worse contract. dieng is hilariously overpaid but covington is awesome and the 11th pick is juicy

[Hoops Czar]

What team in their right mind other than the Knicks would give Derozan max?

Spurs fans prior to this year.

[cutewizard]

The defeat of the Warriors will have reverberations

[cutewizard]

"Lord of the Rings" like reverberations

[cutewizard]

It seems to me that

Kawhi is about to become the LORD OF THE RINGS, LOL