MIA: Rasho Nesterovic

[nkdlunch]

Where is this guy? is he still injured? I don't remember him playing any minutes last night.

[Slomo]

DNP CD

[ducks]

when nazr was playing as well as he was you sit him
if rasho was playing that well last night you sit nazr

[SPARKY]

DNP-SLOVENIAN

[spur219]

Did you see Nazr play last night? If you did then you know why Rasho didn't play.

[TNT21]

IMO Rasho should not start ever again! I guarantee you in a million years he could not have a game like Nazr did last night. He's just too timid. He needs to find his sack or borrow one.

[Gummi]

I wonder how these playoffs will affect the future of Rasho? I mean, if Nazr is going to continue to play like he has over the course of these playoffs, Rasho's not going to get many minutes and then hopefully add Scola to the mix and there won't be much left.

[nkdlunch]

Did you see Nazr play last night? If you did then you know why Rasho didn't play.

What does that mean? Nazr didn't play 44 minutes. Rasho could have been inserted for a few minutes. My question still stands

[Xolotl]

What does that mean? Nazr didn't play 44 minutes. Rasho could have been inserted for a few minutes. My question still stands

I could be mistaking let me know if I am. But, didn't Pop go small when he decided to sit Nazr down? In order to match the Sonics.

[Gummi]

Pop matched Seattle's small lineup of Daniels, Ridnour, Allen, Wilkins, and Collison/Fortson. You can't play both Duncan and Nazr when they have small and quick guys out there.

[SLOVENIAN 8]

RASHO>Nazr

[TNT21]

RASHO>Nazr


Look Slov 8, I know you have to root for your countryman, but seriously, Nazr pulls down more rebounds in one game that Rasho does in 10. The only reason I would want Rasho out there is because they have to respect his 10 foot jumpshot and because he knows the defense a little better.

[Useruser666]

:lol

[spur219]

I think Rasho would make a decent fine backup center behind Nazr. But he gets paid too much to let him ride on the bench.

[SPARKY]

Nazr takes more FTs in eight minutes on the court than Radobitch gets in eighty games...

[Jimcs50]

Rasho is going to the Nets next year.

You heard it here first.

[SPARKY]

Hopefully the Spurs can get something worthwhile for Radobitch. That's who they should've moved instead of Malik.

[TMSKILZ]

Rasho is going to the Nets next year.

You heard it here first.
What would we get in return? They already have Nenad Kristic.

[SPARKY]

The Spurs will package him with Manu Ginobili so they can obtain Vince Carter, which will allow rascal and Sequ to nut on themselves repeatedly.

[SWC Bonfire]

Hopefully we'll get to see how useful Rasho is against Shaq, that should determine his worth.

[SLOVENIAN 8]

The Spurs will package him with Manu Ginobili so they can obtain Vince Carter, which will allow rascal and Sequ to nut on themselves repeatedly.
:lmao :lmao :lmao

[waly.mg]

One big trade:

The Spurs sends Rasho Nesterovic and Cash to the New York Knicks for Malik Rose ¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡¡

[SLOVENIAN 8]

Hopefully we'll get to see how useful Rasho is against Shaq, that should determine his worth.


Hopefully we'll get to see how useful NAZR is against Shaq!

[SPARKY]

If only Radosoft for Rose. Zeke would never do it, regardless of bball considerations, given the Abominable Slovenian's shade of skin...

[Jimcs50]

What would we get in return? They already have Nenad Kristic.

Jefferson

Some kind of package to acquire Jefferson. He can play defense, he can score and he can rebound.

[winstonchillifoot]

I "was" happy when we first acquired Rasho, he was a decent player in Minnesota avg 11 pts. a game. Then he goes to a contender and drops off to 4pts a game. I'm not shitting on him 'cause his lack of game speaks for himself but he needs to be more aggressive.

[Slomo]

If only Radosoft for Rose. Zeke would never do it, regardless of bball considerations, given the Abominable Slovenian's shade of skin...
Calm down Snoopy, it ain't happenin'. Don't forget they had that option but decided to ship the lesser player to NY.

Xenophobe!
(It's OK, use google, nobody will know)

[SPARKY]

NY wouldn't take back the lesser player. So we're stuck with the Slammin' Slovene.

[Slomo]

NY wouldn't take back the lesser player. So we're stuck with the Slammin' Slovene.
Keep telling yourself that.

If I remember Pop's quote after the trade NY was asking for Rasho.

[SWC Bonfire]

Who is the better player, etc. etc.? I think the point is who cares if they win the championship? Hopefully this becomes a moot point.

[SPARKY]

NY didn't want Rasho or Rasho would've been gone, Jolly Green Slovene.

[SLOVENIAN 8]

Man and at the end when Spurs will play with MIA or DET and if Nazr wont do a shit, what then you would talking about??' Nazr cant do shit, he is worthless........?? :lmao

Some funny shit :lol :lol

[SLOVENIAN 8]

NY didn't want Rasho or Rasho would've been gone, Jolly Green Slovene.


Yes they wants him but Spurs did not let that.

[T Park]

NY didn't want Rasho or Rasho would've been gone,

afraid to tell you, but the original deal was Rasho for Mohammed.

The Spurs declined, then it was Rose for Mohammed, and they went for it.


I wouldnt mind Rasho for Rose, doubt itll happen but next year

Mohammed
Rose
Scola

would be perfect in my mind.

[bigbendbruisebrother]

Jefferson

Some kind of package to acquire Jefferson. He can play defense, he can score and he can rebound.

I agree we need a small forward, and Richard Jefferson would be a great grab. However, I would think we'd have to give up more than Rasho and cash to get Jefferson. Maybe throw in Barry?

from http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jefferi01.html
Richard Jefferson:
Most Similar Season at Age
21. Clyde Drexler (857) (Compare)
21. Ron Artest (857) (Compare)
22. Caron Butler (871) (Compare)
23. Glenn Robinson (895) (Compare)
24. Lionel Simmons (889) (Compare)

[waly.mg]

NY didn't want Rasho or Rasho would've been gone, Jolly Green Slovene.

With NY you never Know, Isiah Thomas can trade T-Mass for Mailk too

The problem is that:

Due to New York and San Antonio being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. New York and San Antonio had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did not happen here (only New York met the condition). This trade does not satisfy the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

If one trade satisfy the CBA Isiah can Made the trade, and thats the trade:

Realgm trade Checker
Trade ID for this scenario is 2384743.

San Antonio Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Radoslav Nesterovic
7-0 C from Slovenia
5.9 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 1.0 apg in 25.5 minutes
Incoming
Malik Rose
6-7 PF from Drexel
8.3 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.7 apg in 23.6 minutes
Change in team outlook: +2.4 ppg, -2.2 rpg, and -0.3 apg.


New York Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Malik Rose
6-7 PF from Drexel
8.3 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 0.7 apg in 23.6 minutes
Incoming
Radoslav Nesterovic
7-0 C from Slovenia
5.9 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 1.0 apg in 25.5 minutes
Change in team outlook: -2.4 ppg, +2.2 rpg, and +0.3 apg.

Successful Scenario
Due to San Antonio and New York being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. San Antonio and New York had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement.

[bigbendbruisebrother]

Man and at the end when Spurs will play with MIA or DET and if Nazr wont do a shit, what then you would talking about??' Nazr cant do shit, he is worthless........?? :lmao

Some funny shit :lol :lol

Are you high? Nazr can't do shit and is worthless? He's figured out how to do what Rasho never has--take advantage of the fact that Tim Duncan is double teamed and cash it in on the weak side. Rasho plays solid D, but Nazr is rapidly catching up in that department too.

Side note: After Nazr's three point play in the third, it was cool to see the bench explode cheering him on with Rasho yelling the loudest.

[SLOVENIAN 8]

Are you high? Nazr can't do shit and is worthless?

I did not say that he is worthless!!! I said IF!!!

[bigbendbruisebrother]

I did not say that he is worthless!!! I said IF!!!

Ah, sorry. I misinterpreted your post.

[Man In Black]

Damn it ain't all that complicated.

Pop played positional matchups and Nazr matches up better than Rasho does for this round. Nazr's offensive game is ahead of Rasho's and defensively it's just the opposite.

PAY ATTENTION HERE->BOTH OF THEM GIVE THE SPURS SOME BEEF IN THE POST TO DEAL WITH THE SHAQ'S & WALLACES OF THE WORLD. We're better with both.

[Gummi]

Pop seems to like Rasho's game alot so I doubt that he'll be traded this off-season. I would really like to get a athletic PF like Horry in exchange for Rasho. Don't forget people that Luis Scola is probable here in San Antonio next season so that will mean less minutes for backup players like Horry and Rasho.

[Supergirl]

Rasho will be needed when (not if) we face Detroit or Miami (most likely the former) in the Finals.

TMass will get more minutes than too. They're both better defenders, but Nazr gives us more offensively. And he's improved his defense considerably, which will motivate Rasho to fight to keep is starting spot.

[nkdlunch]

Damn it ain't all that complicated.

Pop played positional matchups and Nazr matches up better than Rasho does for this round. Nazr's offensive game is ahead of Rasho's and defensively it's just the opposite.

PAY ATTENTION HERE->BOTH OF THEM GIVE THE SPURS SOME BEEF IN THE POST TO DEAL WITH THE SHAQ'S & WALLACES OF THE WORLD. We're better with both.

Thanks. This is the best response yet.

[wildbill2u]

Rasho is going to the Nets next year.

You heard it here first.

Nah, let's see if Isaiah has anything left in the Knick's cupboard (other than Malik). He's so easy to take a bad deal we can probably skin him one more time before he's fired. :elephant

[Supergirl]

Scola will take Horry's minutes, I suspect Horry will retire or have a greatly reduced role in the coming years. He's getting older and is much more potent when he can come in, play hard defense, block a few shots, hit a few spot-up 3's, but not average more than 10-15 minutes a game.

[Karl Mundt]

I am not going to bash Nazr or defend Rasho here, but what do some of the people who have been watching the playoffs (and know a bit about basketball) think about their Roland ratings?

http://www.82games.com/0405SAS.HTM (regular season)
http://www.82games.com/playoffs/045PSAS.HTM (playoffs)

Despite Rasho's decline in traditional stats (especially offensive) and Nazr producing some very good ones, you can notice fairly clearly the team seems to do better when Rasho is on the court than when Nazr is there. During the regular season the team was +11 points per 48 minutes with Rasho in the lineup and +5.1 when he was on the bench, while with Nazr in the team the Spurs would average a -6.5 point differential and a +9.5 without him.

Difference:
17.5 points in Rasho's favour, or 21.8 if you include the off court +/-.

Some would argue (i'm sure to extent correctly) that there is difference in starting and coming off the bench because the starters play more minutes with the best lineup, but then when you look at playoff numbers, it doesn't change all that much, and Rasho still produces much better +/- numbers than Nazr even while coming off the bench: Team with Rasho: +15.3, without him: +7.8. Team with Nazr: +3.9, without him: +13.8.

Difference:
11.4 points in Rasho's favour, 17.3 if you include the off court stats aswell.

Now i've been disappointed with Rasho's performance so far this year and i'd probably give him a D at best for his improvement from last year (or lack off), and i don't have anything at all against Nazr, i think it's amazing for a team to have two centers who could start in half of the teams in the league, but those numbers to me maybe suggest there is a lot of things in the game that affect the score more than traditional stats do. It's still too early to judge Nazr since he hasn't been here long enough to really learn the defensive system, but what does everyone think of that +/- discrepancy?

[SWC Bonfire]

I'm seated in the bulkhead row seat on the Rasho bandwagon, but the +/- stat seems like total BS to me. It can be influenced by too many factors, considering that there are 9 other guys on the court contributing to a player's +/-.

And your name is frighteningly similar to mine, Karl Mundt. That's Slovenian and not German?

[Supergirl]

Rasho's not going anywhere. I don't know where people are getting the impresion the original trade was proposed to be for Rasho. I remember Pop talking about the motivation for the trade being 1. salary cap relief and 2. gaining some height in our back up centers. Trading Rasho for Rose - or almost anyone, other than Shaq or Brad Miller - would be a significant downgrade in defense and in height.

SPurs give up Rose and Nazr shines in the playoffs.
Knicks give up Nazr and head to the lottery, with Rose.
I think it's clear the trade was a good move, as much as I love and miss Rose as a personality.

[SLOVENIAN 8]

I could surley say that if SPURS face with MIA or DET and if Rasho again wont play and Massenburg than it is hard to belive that we will win the Championship.

[Karl Mundt]

I'm seated in the bulkhead row seat on the Rasho bandwagon, but the +/- stat seems like total BS to me. It can be influenced by too many factors, considering that there are 9 other guys on the court contributing to a player's +/-.

And your name is frighteningly similar to mine, Karl Mundt. That's Slovenian and not German?

I agree with you about the +/- stats being influenced by many factors (and i think there should be some formula that would take into account +/- ratings for all players on the court and off the court of both teams to get a true individual stat), but with a big enough sample and with a difference as big as that mentioned in my post, i think it's a fair starting point for a debate.


I think the name is German, not really my name though.


On the Rasho/Nazr/Thomas trade: Knicks wanted Rasho for Nazr, Spurs wanted to trade Malik. Knicks adjusted by offering Thomas+Nazr for Rasho+Malik, Spurs refused again. At the end they settled on Nazr for Malik + 1st round draft picks. Basically the Spurs rather gave up two first round draft picks than to package in Rasho in the trade for Kurt Thomas. But really anything after that "Pay up, bitch" from Marcus is just pure comedy. :lol

[Useruser666]

I don't think the ratings you are using can be considered very accurate for the comparison you are making. Do the numbers used as Rasho's sampling come from the entire season, or during the same period which Nazr was on the team? If you are using Rasho's entire regular season numbers, then it's not an accurate comparison to Nazr's numbers, when he has only played for a few games during the end of the season.

Another point must be made due to the nature of the two players' playing time. When Nazr came to the team he did not take Rasho's place. He took Rose's place (or playing time). Not since Nazr has taken Rasho's starting role can you compare his performance to that of Rasho when he was starting. Rasho's numbers since he's been injured aren't really a valid comparison for Nazr now either. I think that both perceived +/- and stat based +/- comparisons between Rasho and Nazr must both be taken with a grain of salt. Either method of determining these players worth is based on either somewhat incomplete or uncomparable data.

I'm glad we did trade for Nazr. He has really started to come around and be an effective contributor for the Spurs. I also believe he has an upside in that he will only become better and more comfortable the more he plays within the Spurs system.