soccer= .
I was comparing with the argie NT. Having an alltime top player doesnt mean you can contend( except italy 94 with baggio carrying them to the finale).Sagnol was a nice player but not a monster, I'd say decent in a contender squad.
Gallas was still good
Thuram was not anymore 98 thuram at 34 y/o but he brought experience
Abidalgreat in spain I guess never be a great international
Makele at 33 y/o was still good
Viera was beastin' I agree
The squad had what ? 3 stars ? zidane, viera and henry.. Try to rank France 2006 among the best finalist teams in terms of talent, they dont crack the top 10.
As for zidane i agree his performance against brazil was awsome, even against italy he was great.
This. Even though I dont think Heinze or Burdisso are that terrible, they have been terrible lately, and for 2010 we had a terrible defense, both in terms of personnel and the system. Demichelis is much more terrible than them IMO. People love to hate on Maradona, but he tried literally hundreds of players, and all people cling to is Zanetti- a player I really like and respect- but who was already old and not going to fix the problem (central defense). By trying so many players Maradona all but ensured we would not defend well as a team, and individually we sucked, therefore, we sucked. Maradona tried to go all in with the attack and it didnt work, but given the players and time available Im not sure if there was a better option.
Having a poor defense in the WC is a recipe for disaster. Teams with good D always overachieve, teams with bad D seldom do. Everyone thinks of Brazil as winning on pure offense, but the Pele teams had some great defenders on them, 94 was a defense team, even the 02 team had a very solid D.
Bottomline Messi has only had one chance- 2010- and he played good, not great. IMO it was always going to take a small miracle for that team to win, the only way was if they were able to be really efficient finishing up front and the fact of the matter is they were barely able to get 3-4 chances vs. Germany and they failed to capitalize on any of them. Still, I cant see how anyone can argue Argentina underachieved in 2010- we hadn't finished any better since 1990, and in the run up to the WC we looked even worse. In an elimination tournament, I'd rather lose 7-0 trying to win than 1-0 saving face.
Also, though not as big of a problem as defense, all of Argentina's offensive talent is redundant, we dont have any big striker or aerial game period. And as most every european champ ever has shown, it is very important to have players that can put pressure on the defense in free kicks and corners. When messi, aguero, di maria, tevez or any of those guys gets fouled or forces a corner, we are hard pressed to capitalize on it, and that's a problem that goes back all the way to 2008. Its easy to forget that vs Germany, Argentina had more possession, more shots on goal, and more corners. And when things get tight, you are practically forced to either look for a cross or shoot from outside; it really helps to have at least one forward with an aerial game. I cant even remember the last time argentina scored on a corner kick.
I think the next WC, barring injury, will be Messi's best chance to prove himself; championship or not, he has to play great.
Last thought- WC success is not formulaic and upsets happen, you have to factor health, luck, the rhythm of the players (both teams), the ref... and it is harder for a guy like Messi to do his thing when he relies so much on his dribble- part of the reason he is amazing is that he is able to consistently do it, but in 5-8 games anything can happen
baggio 94 was extremely lucky, bulgaria should have beat them. Italy 06 was also extremely lucky. in the WC happens and in 94 and 06 Italy was very lucky (unlike in 02, when they were on the other end of it)
to be fair i should add that in 90 and to a lesser extent 86 maradona's argentina teams had a good bit of luck too
Good thread
LMAO I actually think last WC Argentina scored on a corner...and it was either Demichelis, Heinze, or one of the other horrible, horrible defenders that did not deserve a goal
lmao, turns out I was correct with both of them, but Demi's goal was a rebound, and Heinze's was pretty good but it wasn't a contested header
goddamn it thinking about these scrubs is making laugh and i don't know why
lmao, in the Heinze goal I think it's Samuel who does a great job playing the offensive tackle, blocking the defenders
I wonder if all of the fools saying Messi had a poor WC because he failed to score believe Demichelis played better than Messi did for his ty rebound goal
By his standards yes he has a poor WC and it has nothing to do with scoring goals. When you are the "so-called" best player in the world the minimum is to be the best player during the WC or at least the be close to that.I wonder if all of the fools saying Messi had a poor WC because he failed to score believe Demichelis played better than Messi did for his ty rebound goal
Seriously, Neymar?Pele: If Messi wants to be the best ever first he must become better than Neymar
Brazilian football idol Pele has restated his belief that Neymar is a better player than Barcelona star Lionel Messi, and argued that the Argentine must first overcome the young Santos star before he can challenge 'O Rei' as the greatest to ever play the game.
The three-time World Cup winner was speaking on Tuesday at a press conference marking Santos' centenary celebrations in April 2012. Never shy about publicizing the ability of Neymar to the press, the 71-year-old pushed the youngster ahead of Messi in his list of the world's current stars.
"Now everyone is talking about Messi, he is a star. But [to be the best ever] he must first become better than Neymar," he asserted. "At the moment Messi is just more experienced."
The Brazilian also played down the public feud he has allegedly maintained with Diego Maradona, insisting that there is no bad blood between the two men.
"You [journalists] are always saying that I am Maradona's rival, but it is not true. I was never his rival, and he was a great attacking midfielder," the legend explained.
Re ed argument from Pele
He still s on Messi though
He didn't have a poor WC by any standars.
Nobody gave a before nobody will now
Dont worry I will repost it regularlyNobody gave a before nobody will now
how so ?
I don't think you will argue (I would but you wouldn't) against the fact he is the best player in the world in 2010. Has he been the best player of the WC?
2006 World Cup will always hold a special place in my heart. I was in Deutschland for the whole games. Greatest sports atmosphere I've ever encourtered
So because he wasn't the best player of the tournament he had a poor performance? That's poor reasoning.
And that has to do with Messi because...?
Just to get this thread back on topic...
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